This the most articulate summary on the subject I have ever heard. Watch it.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3653114296815352489&hl=en

Take a drive through ANY rural area and you will find Meth Maggots..they are everywhere.

The "drug war" against pot is a waste of time, but the Meth, Crack, etc. has GOT TO GO. These nasty substances are ruining America from the (previously) most solid core of citizens on out...

I don't know what a solution might be, but we need to try and do something to stop this nightmare of the Tweekers.

I have no idea "what" will work to stop it, though, but making it legal isn't going to help any of them, IMO.

Mike

WOW.........I actually agree with you for a change.

Where there's a will there's a way, so I think meth will always be present in our society to some extent. However, the feds could all but put an end to it by banning the production of Sudoephedrine by the drug companies. It might make cold remidies less effective, but SFW. Whatever happened to vitamin-C and drinking lots of water?

It seems we are against drug addiction unless it is organized addiction(i.e. the Gov. gets their share).

As with most major issues in our country, follow the money!

It's all about soaring stocks and big bucks in "Blow-me-now America." Dow Chemical and the like give head to the politicians that oversee FDA approval of their wares in return for political campaign contributions. The money generated is an integral part of our economy.
Old school narcotics, on the other hand, are derivatives of plant species that occure naturally in nature. Pretty hard to regulate something Joe Blow can grow in his garden. So, the fuc% heads declaired them illegal, and launched a nationwide campaign to stereo-type ALL users as morally bankrupt losers. Pretty fuc%ing simple.

The truth is, most folks that use pot anyway, are smart people that are capable of metering their intake. They're productive members of society, they pay their taxes, and they care about the welfare of America. Perhaps more so than the "unenlightened" majority.

The fuc%ing bedrock hypocracy in this country makes me sick.

I was listening to a radio show while in Portland a couple weeks back, it was the "Lars Larson" show, and he was trashing the medical marijuana users as being 90% "legal stoners", and saying they were just in it for the cheap dope.

One older lady called in, and she was a Med. Marijuana user and, like many others, she had found it was the ONLY medication that would manage her symptoms.

I know that there are a number of drugs that can help with some diseases, but they are addictive and can have nasty side effects. Pot, OTOH, is non-addictive, and very fast acting to effectively "shut-down" serious symptoms that can (and do) occur with many non-fatal diseases.

Sadly, those it can help are often dissuaded from using it due to a mis-directed public identification of marijuana with a bunch of long-haired, homeless and usless stoners.

Fact is, Pot has some incredible curative properties that are not even close to being fully realized by the medical world.

Please don't ask me how I know so much about this..

Mike

I think the prohibitionist crowd is preoccupied with the other thread. I say leave the potheads alone!

Anybody suffer from RLS?

Restless leg syndrome? Come on, isn't that just your body telling you to get off your fat ass?

I dislike the terms, "pot head" or "stoner" or the like because they are derogatory. If people use them they are only perpetuating the stereo type. Is everyone that drinks a "drunk"? I think not.

Pot will be around forever. I think the Meth thing may be self correcting. There is no such thing as an "old" Tweaker. By that I mean one thats done it for years and years. It beats them up real bad real fast. The biggest concern with meth is the load it places on the leagle system. Jails, prisons are just crammed with tweakers. Pot users seldom get arrested because a> they never really do anything stupid and b> they don't turn to crime to get what they want.

How about legalize Pot and use the procedes to pay for the huge bill being racked up by meth.

I once saw a documentary some years ago that went along these lines " The amount of money spent on drugs would make it the number 1 industery in the world. The Amount of money that disappears from the economy tax free on drugs annually is greater than the national debt "

I would have to look up where I saw that but if you think about it you know its true.

Hilarious, the term "Pot-head is derogatory," Keerist, I hope so. "pot-heads never do anything stupid" hahahahaha. Better rethink that one.
I will agree that the billions spent on be the DEA is a supreme waste. Quit fighting the vendor, eliminate the user. NO market no sales.
Drugs as pharmaceutical pain relief for critically needy patients is another ball game. The problem there is an MD gets paid for writing a prescription. It's easy to become dependent on something you think makes your life more bearable. Think Rush. Course, if your life is unbearable, fix it, your choice.
Btw the best thing I know that POT has done is called "Cheech and Chong."

Good point Sol. I'm sorry I perpetuated the stereotype, it's really the last thing WE need isn't it? I should know better. It's the last 30 years of "indoctrination" I've been subject to.
Sard, I just don't know what to say. Someone needs to slip you a strong batch of brownies or something...

Sard: Some people that smoke weed do stupid shi%, so everyone that smokes it is stupid? You're a jackass of monumental proportion if you subscribe to that logic.

Also, it's not a matter of being "dependant" on something that makes life more "bearable." It's a matter of "choosing" to endulge in something that makes life more "enjoyable," no different than a glass of wine or an evening cocktail.

How bout a response from Churchgoer on this one?

Saw that movie MOE. Annie B Toklas, was funny I admit.
I realize that some folks that are considered pretty bright indulge in a bit of smoked cannabis now and then. Even a Rhodes Scholar to two.
Perhaps, Sol, if you re-read my post you would discover that I did not say all pot smoker were stupid. However, you must admit the percentage is probably fairly high. no pun intended
"A glass of wine for thy stomach's sake" is a well remember quote from the good book. I don't see any comment pro or con about a bit of black tar, hashish or any of the other various mind altering organics. And those items didn't just jump on the scene in modern times. Native Americans have been using psylocibin for centuries. Usually the Shaman, but occasionally for a group trip. Good old Feds told them schrooms were illegal. Now there's one of the funnies.
If nothing else the alcohol is at least legal. Of course that doesn't matter to many. Respect for the rules of our society is a long lost virtue. So is accountability for that matter.
MD prescribed pot for terminal patients, pain control etc. is ok by me. And if you want to make pot legal, that too is ok by me. Just tax it like it was booze and allow the Olympians to have the monopoly as usual in this state.
A bottle of Hennesy Cognac is 20 bucks in Ca. It's nearly $50 here. There's state's rights for ya. And Ahnold has a bigger bunch of socialists to deal with than we do.

Salud.

Please to forgive Aunty. I would never ignore you. Of course your reference to my stupidity almost nudged me into a repartee in kind. I resisted.
If one chooses to end an unrewarding life, I think that is their privilege. Society goes to great length and expense to counsel everyone that life is worth living and hang in there and MAYBE something wonderful will happen. Accent on the Maybe.
I don't advocate suicide, however it is obviously an option for some. The tragedy there is in that the young who really have not experienced the possibilities of the gift of life are often the victims of the self-destructive spiral.
There are many, poor mes, that need to get off their butts and make a life. How to motivate them is beyond my abilities. Aggravating them is probably good therapy.

Thank you, Aunty!
GREAT pun, Sard!

If you Doc offered you the option of taking:

A) A combination of Valium and Phenagren, daily.
(Slightly effective to control vomiting and Vertigo..but ya still puke yer guts out for a few hours about once a week. BOTH are highly addictive physically. Your a zombie most days due to the side effects, too)

OR

B) Marijuana that works 99% of the time to stop all symptoms of the Daily sizziness and Vertigo, settle your belly, and also give you an appetite. No puking at all, and it can stop a Vertigo attack once it starts. No addictive physically, and only a small amt. daily at bedtime was requied, therefore you could continue to operate in your professional life and continue to support your family and HAVE A LIFE worth living.

Which would you choose? One is legally prescribed, and the other, without prescription, is not legal.

Mike

Last first out. If you want to shed a little skin I'll oblige you Aunty. I guess you didn't notice that I allowed prescription pot for some cases. And if it is available by prescription where is the difficulty in having an MD generate the paper work?
Mike the answer to your question is obvious. Why can you not get prescribed pot? Aren't the drugs in the first option prescription drugs?

Methinks public pressure could reform marijuana laws if we could step out of the closet without being busted.

Sard: No worries. UW has a program for this.

Moe: I might agree, but there does need to be an apparatus in place to direct youth (under 18) away from pot. It can have side effects that WILL harm a childs development emotionally and mentally. Kids (12 to 17-18) are out to "get stoned", not just catch a buzz. That heavy of use will affect their school performance and have an effect on their future abilities to perform technical jobs. Of course, there are exceptions to the rule, but in general youth does not moderate their use of such a drug.

I believe in legal use of marijuana as a medication, and if the laws were set up right would agree (vote for) it's legalization and taxation for recreational use just like liquor, so long as safeguards to keep young kids away from it were in place.

Mike

C'mon Aunty, we've been there already yet. You are seeming a bit testy. Another example of why a woman would make a lousy president. Mood swings.lol
I would vote for a pot law change that made it easier for needy medical recepients to get the meds they need. I would also vote for a serious rap in the pocketbook for the MDS that become peddlers in the prescription racket that's bound to follow.

Makes sense to me. Gonadal transplants are very expensive. Although there are so many in the political arena that seem to have rejection problems they may be more common than I thought. I agree on Condi. And although I like what little I know of the First Lady, I wouldn't vote for her either.
Now Zell Miller or Stormin' Norman would get a second look. And rejected Joe looks better now than he ever did as a VP candidate.
I still think we oughta draft our Presidents.

If I were King (not "the king") for a day, I'd eliminate half the crime in this country by legalizing all drugs. Period. And I would't try taxing every then legal drug. That would just drive more of the trade back underground, where it's most profitable. Then the big profit would disappear from the now illicit drug trade and pharmacutical grade everything would be cheap, for those who want it. Not to mention the more than $100 billion a year we spend on this unwinnable war.

Take a fraction of the money spent on the war on drugs and spend it on drug education and rehab for those who want it. Those who would blow their minds, let 'em; society is better off without them. But the rehab would be society's way of extending a helping hand to those who want to pull themselves out of it.

Perfect! I could not agree more. I don't think most teenagers have the disipline or mindset to manage their responcibilities in school, work, home or society in general, where consumption of alcohol and marijuana are concerned. It seems to stiffle most kids motivation to accel. For this reason I think it is the resoncibility of a parent or parents that are pro-weed to be hypocritical and hide that fact from their kids until thay are older. I don't know a single kid I grew up with whose parents let them sit around and smoke dope in high school who is not a total loser, today. And I knew a lot of them. In fact, most of them are over weight and still live at home today. LOSERS.

On the other hand, I believe people who have moved on through college or have succeeded in a carrier they enjoy and are passionate about their intrests in life without letting their use of alcohol or marijuana alter their personalities in a negative way, should be judged on the merits of their accomplishments and not be sterio-typed with the lackies.

Yes, I have put the stuff away since my kids became "aware". Sad but true. And you are right about the ones who partook regularly in HS (even JHS!). They fell off-track for the most part. I never inhaled until my USMC pals at Pendleton turned me on in my early 20's. Oorah!

It's harder for a teenager to get booze than weed. That's because booze is legal and regulated.

Kids can still get it, but it requires way more effort.

I'm with Salmo. Legalize everything and let people be. Remove the prohibition, and you remove much of the profit motive. The crime that surrounds the drug trade would diminish.

Of course, if a politician was to propose such a position they'd be crucified as being pro-drug. I guess that would normally be better than pro-idiocy, but not in politics.

We have been 'winning" the war on drugs vere since I was 12. Now that's a loooog time.

Legalize pot, tax the hell out of it and use the money to fight hard drugs.

Wow - just discovdered this part of the BB - great topic.

It amazes me that "society" finds alcohol to be legal and weed not. People who who are drunk are way more aggressive and their physical control is affected to a much higher degree.

Potential confrontation w/someone who just toked: "hey man, it's cool - how ya doin'"

Potential confrrontation w/someone who's drunk: "what the F you lookin' at a-hole - f you - etc. etc. till it leads to blows.

I work in the creative/advertising industry and most people in this industry are highly educated, and earn much higher than average salaries (hence contribute more than most to society in taxes). I'd say close to 50% of the people in my industry smoke weed either occasionally or regularly and do so responsibly. It sucks that these people are criminals for responsibly enjoying a naturally occuring herb. I agree that it should be kept from under-age users who are not at a point in their life to make a responsible choice about if/how/when to use it. Same as Alcohol, porno, voting, etc. Some people just need to chill and and take a sip off a bong. What a great way to relax and enjoy your evening - quick, effective, simple, without the loss of major motor skills or causing aggressive, confrontational behavior.

My .02

The war on drugs is a farce. Employment security for some Federal employees. However, I think it sad that you gotta smoke some dope to have a good time. The same applies for alcohol for that matter.
Legalize hemp farming. Give our agricultural denizens some market share.

We eat sweets because they taste good. We have sex because it feels good. We fish because it's an adrenaline rush. Everything we enjoy in life is the result of stimulating brain chemisty one way or another. We don't *gotta* do anything.

I really must agree with most of you on this thread. The "war on drugs" is hilarious. cocaine is south america's #1 cash crop (even more than coffee). How much has our government profited off of the prohibition of drugs. Do some research the numbers are staggering. As far as pot goes lets just not look at the medicinal value of it, look at everything else that is good about it, the seeds, the hemp that has many good uses for it. Didn't some of our former presidents actually farm it. Someone in this thread earlier mentioned pot users were losers, my friend you would be very shocked at some of the daily pot users that half of us look up to. 90% of the time i found myself into trouble (even with the wife) i was usually drinking the legal stuff!

PS* (sp?) Annheiser busch spends more money in stopping the cultivation of marijuana than any other organization in the US ( I guess that is one of those things that make you go hmmmmmmm)

Fishdon'tbite,

Have you got a source you can cite for the claim about Annheiser-Busch?

I will find some of the articles, they are from awhile ago, there are actually quite a few tabacco companies that contribute also. I believe it started with the "Partnership for a Drug free America" Its been a few years so i will do some searching when i get a chance.

NORML.....do something about it!

Actually Yes I do...I do not take any medication for it. About once a month it keeps me from getting to sleep for about 4-5 hours at night. It never bothers me during the day, only when I try and sleep and only about a dozen times a year. It is kind of a aching in my legs and my legs sort of feel like they are moving while I am lying in bed.

and you ain't fat!

Well that should help keep grass prices up as all us aging hippies begin losing our memories.

"Yeah, I know all about the 60s. I was there. I think."